FAA Advocacy Meeting January 15 and 16

While the AMA continues to address registration legally and through Congress, members are being asked to register with the FAA.  Pilots do not register their aircraft, they register as a pilot and place their registration number in all of their aircraft.

 

For decades, the AMA has had a tremendous safety record. For this reason, and based on the protections from Section 336 that we helped pass into law, we do not believe that our 188,000 members should be subject to the UAS registration rule. Section 336 is part of the 2012 FAA Modernization and Reform Act in which Congress recognized the effectiveness of community-based safety guidelines and exempted recreational/hobbyists from any new regulations.

The AMA is working with Congress and looking at legal options to address registration.  On a parallel path, we are advocating on behalf of our members directly with the FAA to find a solution.  On January 15 Rich Hanson, Bob Brown, Gary Fitch, Chad Budreau, and AMA’s legal counsel conducted a meeting with the FAA.  During the visit the AMA discussed several issues impacting the modeling community including registration.  We brought a list of our members’ concerns and asked the FAA for a clarification or a resolution to our concerns.

We raised multiple questions around the guidelines pilots must agree to during the registration process, such as the requirement to stay below 400 feet.  The FAA acknowledged that AMA members should continue to follow AMA’s community-based safety code.  We also discussed and the FAA confirmed that the language on the FAA registration site is a guideline, not regulation.  This guideline is not directed at the AMA community but rather, it is a simplified set of safety guidelines geared to the general public.

We specifically addressed the 400 foot altitude limitation and explained how under appropriate circumstances some modeling activity necessarily occurs above 400’ and other activity occurs at altitude to protect modelers and spectators on the ground. The FAA understands that this community flies higher than the guideline and acknowledged that AMA pilots can abide by their own safety code which is proven to provide safe aeromodelling operations

We also raised concerns with the FAA about a possibly stricter registration process for large model airplanes over 55 pounds such as requiring an “N” number.  The FAA acknowledged these concerns and we discussed possible ways to revise the large model aircraft registration process going forward.

In addition, we discussed the numerous affiliate AMA members, non-US citizen or non-US resident competitors, and citizens who are currently away from the states who have not been able to register on the FAA site. The registration site so far has not accepted foreign applications, foreign addresses or foreign IP addresses.  The FAA shares our concern about this and is working on a solution, which is expected in early February.

Many of our members have raised concerns about the privacy and security of the federal registration database.  While we know that the database will be searchable by federal registration number, we do not know yet what additional information will be publicly available. We expressed strong concerns with the release of personal information, especially the personal data of AMA’s youth members . We will continue to press the FAA to safeguard the security of our members’ personal information.

We understand there are AMA members who do not have a computer or do not want to submit a credit card during the application process.  We discussed with the FAA the use of a paper application, which currently is only available at local FAA Flight Standards Ditrict Offices (FSDO).  To make these paper applications easier to obtain, AMA is working to acquire these documents, which we can send to members who request them.  As for members who are willing to register online, but cannot or do not want to submit credit card information, the FAA has agreed to accept gift credit cards such as Visa or Mastercard.

For those clubs that own a model aircraft as an organization and not as an individual, we requested clarification as to how to register the model. We concluded that those models should be registered under the registration of one of the club leaders.  To protect that club leader who voluntarily placed his number in or on the club aircraft, the member should have a written document from the club indicating he or she should not be held responsible and is simply providing a registration number on behalf of the club.

Finally, there is confusion around whether members register themselves or their aircraft.  Members register themselves and place their number in or on their aircraft.

At the end of our meeting with the FAA, we invited FAA representatives to join the AMA leadership at a nearby flying site to showcase firsthand AMA’s safety protocols, demonstrate club camaraderie and mentoring, and provide the opportunity for the FAA to speak with AMA members in-person.

 

 

283 comments

  1. “For those clubs that own a model aircraft as an organization and not as an individual, we requested clarification as to how to register the model. We concluded that those models should be registered under the registration of one of the club leaders. To protect that club leader who voluntarily placed his number in or on the club aircraft, the member should have a written document from the club indicating he or she should not be held responsible and is simply providing a registration number on behalf of the club.”

    How can this be remotely legal? Its the officers number on the UAS so its his responsibility. No letter from the club can absolve him of that responsibility. The AMA needs to get this in writing from the FAA. If it is really their position it should not be a problem to get it in writing. Same goes for the 400ft issue.

    You have a legal counsel with you and he signed off that a rumor from an unrecorded meeting would stand up in court?

    1. Hi Heath,

      We did request these statements be made in writing. The FAA agreed and will make updates to their website or will confirm these agreements in an FAA document.

      1. As president of my club, I am sure all fingers will point to me to put my registration on club owned trainers. It is my belief, that if the FAA doesn’t make this clear by deadline, I should ground all club owned aircraft until it is made clear by FAA instead of hoping a piece of paper will protect me. Does the AMA agree with this thought?

        1. The FAA, along with their legal advisers in the room, advised us of the solution mentioned above. Other clubs have adopted a slightly different solution in which the club trainer or model has a removable FAA tag. When a club member flies the club owned aircraft, that pilot inserts their own personal FAA number in the aircraft. Either solution would be acceptable by the FAA.

      2. III. Good Cause for Immediate Adoption
        Section 553(b)(3)(B) of the Administrative Procedure Act (APA) (5 U.S.C.) authorizes agencies to dispense with notice and comment procedures for rules when the agency for “good cause” finds that those procedures are “impracticable, unnecessary, or contrary to the public interest.” Under this section, an agency, upon finding good cause, may issue a final rule without seeking comment prior to the rulemaking

        Well, In my opinion the AMA has shown its lack of political clout. The above LAW- allows the FAA to do as it sees fit. The proliferation of Drones- and the lawless,careless operation of same is truly contrary to public interest. There is not a court in this land that will rule otherwise.

        We are in a time where defined Constitutional Rights are being trivialized by the Executive Branch, Congress and the Courts. Flying ANYTHING is a priviledge. That said,its clear the FAA had their ducks in a row far before the AMA came to the table. Now that I have acquired a private site, no more AMA for me. I’ll spend the $70 or so on something that will actually serve my needs.

      3. The current faa rules are ridiculous a foreign visitor to the USA should not have to get a registration locate and contact 15 different airports that are within a 5 mile radius to fly 20 meters above ground to take an aerial selfie with a drone. These are non commercial activities and it is even questionable if faa has any constitutional authority to request permission (registration/permit) from citizens. Why not dump the registration process and adopt some rules fpr those wishing to fly take photos out of the range or airspace of manned aircraft and people? It should be easy for visitors to fly their toys at low altitude without needing permission. A lot of this is just a result of information superflow due to technology rapidly spreading rumours. The drone that was accused of stopping firefighters was a fabrication of the media. It was a driver stuck in traffic that deployed a drone to scan ahead and see why traffic was backed up. No charges were filed in that case. Furthermore laypeople and media has spread lies about what a small drone can do to a manned aircraft. There have been collisions with birds much heavier than drones which resulted in no damage. The odds of something happening are very low. Most drones would be forced away from a helicopter by being pushed by rotors turbulence. The reality needs to be set straight. I don’t know any normal drone pilot of an expensive $1-3K drone that wants to crash it into something. Right now the rules are so ridiculous that there is really no place one can fly and take some selfies. A serious discussion needs to happen with the FAA.

        1. well, there is no doubt that this administration and their minions,have come up with their share of draconian legislation. Knee jerk reactions affected Certificated Commercial Pilots seeking ATP certificates. Mandated training costing $10,000 plus- JUST TO SIT FOR THE WRITTEN EXAM! Just because TWO unqualified nitwits flew a perfectly functioning Dash-8 into a residential complex-killing 50 people. The cost is part of FLYING professionally and I got to bend over and take it- or not fly in Part121 aviation.

          That said, if you dont think a drone,or other TOY- ripping through and disabiling the best Pratt, GE or Rolls Royce has to offer is an overstatement, gross exageration or down right lie is acting like a child who cant play after school. There is a legitimate danger that there WILL BE an accident- and God Forbid if it involves killing innocent people, our hobby is DONE. I have spoke with and corresponded with AMA officials repeatedly within the last few months and realized that they have a good heart- but have been woefully misrepresented and billed by the legal team.

          Section 336, wont be upheld. I’m amused by AMA talking about “our right to fly”! Show me where in the US Constitution, flying is mentioned- let alone as a RIGHT. It is a privilege. Putting anything in the sky- makes that anything under the control of the FAA. The AMA brought a knife to a gunfight. The deal was done before they got to D.C.. Its done, and I’m done with the AMA.

          As soon as the no skill to fly kits- of all types- hit the market,it made the learning curve non existent. The AMA , in my opinion, found an enourmous cash cow. Just look at the Feb,2016 magazine. Full of drone adds and NOT ONE SINGLE NEGATIVE “to the editor” showing the membership outrage. I’ve been called “another uninformed person”! I do, however, realize that “Im with the FAA and want to help” is the biggest joke in aviation. I guess the AMA cooperation with the FAA, wasnt all that informed.

    2. After 4 plus years of meetings, communications, information gathering, and dialogue, the AMA has failed to communicate to the FAA that we are a responsible and safe community who partake in our hobby with every intention of following our safety codes. In one of the panel discussions at the end of that long period of dialogue between the FAA & AMA, Lynn Spencer commented after citing an incident of a rogue pilot who posted a video on YouTube which almost resulted an injury causing impact, “I just want to find out what it is that you guys do to keep your model operations safe”. There is a glaring example of failing to deliver the message effectively. I believe that if our representation had been more proactive, and on target with a more legal approach, that no FAA ruling would have required AMA members to conduct a separate registration. In the end, the AMA staff has been left dangling in the wind and is still convinced that the FAA is somehow negotiating a concession for the responsible members of the AMA. Let’s be clear, we are wasting our efforts here. Let’s just admit that we failed our club members, and stop pretending like there is some pending reprieve which will exempt us. We should challenge the FAA in every legal context possible including any incidents resulting in possible fines imposed by the FAA to responsible R/C pilots, registered or unregistered, AMA members or not, and send a message to the FAA that their ruling has missed the mark.

    3. How did the club comply with the AMA requirement of attaching an AMA number to the aircraft being flown as a club trainer? AMA did not issue numbers to the club so the issue of an FAA issued number is not them problem here…

  2. So, if the following is true,

    The FAA acknowledged that AMA members should continue to follow AMA’s community-based safety code. We also discussed and the FAA confirmed that the language on the FAA registration site is a guideline, not regulation. This guideline is not directed at the AMA community but rather, it is a simplified set of safety guidelines geared to the general public.

    Unless the FAA starts singing a different tune then we are good to go, back to the way it was. Fly it like you care and all is good.

    Oh ye of little faith. Ill admit it, There were times that it felt like maybe the AMA was possibly not as involved as some of us thought you should be. But, whether by “hook or crook”, that’s the answer I was looking for.

    Thank You

  3. Was there any conversation or understanding regarding the FAA accepting our current AMA numbers for the FAA registration?

    1. Yes, we did discuss this with the FAA. While the FAA agreed in spirit to these terms, at this time their IT team will not be able to explore or implement this.

      1. You don’t need IT integration to do this now. If a model in question is found with an AMA number in/on it, there’s this thing called a phone. A designated rep from the FAA can pick it up and call the AMA to find the member’s info. Quit making things harder on everyone.

        1. UAS registration is handled through a database driven website built the FAA, which requires an IT department. In addition, there are significant privacy concerns with what you are suggesting. We will not disclose our member information, especially through a phone call.

          1. The AMA will provide info in the event police contact them with a number, no? Tell the FAA to forward people with an AMA# to you guys. You require whatever proof of investigation you have always required and that’s that. We don’t need integrated databases. We need faa to drop the requirement for an faa number when the model is owned by an AMA member. Still has to register with the FAA (until that illegal requirement is struck down in court) but people don’t need to retag their models.

          2. It’s my information. You can disclose my private information to anyone or thing I designate if I authorize it. Too many organizations hiding behind this privacy BS.

    2. Isn’t the definition of a Park Plane 2 lbs or under?
      Where is the exemption for park planes?
      (Notice I said PLANES and not DRONES or QUADCOPTERS)
      The exemption for .55 is ludicrous.

      FAA is claiming 300,000 have registered since 12/21/15.
      I don’t believe it – they are lying just like they lie about everything else.

  4. So bottom line, do we go ahead and register now (to save the $5) or do we wait until the FAA changes the wording in the registration process? As a glider pilot 400 feet is a joke and I don’t want to contractually agree with the FAA when I register that I won’t fly above that.

    I know in your statement above, it is now ok to fly above 400 feet if you abide by the AMA Safety Code. But at the end of the day, it’s that little card you print out at the end of the registration process with the FAA that counts.

    Please advise. Thanks!

    1. Since we will not have a resolution to remove or streamline registration by the Federal deadline, we are advising members to register. We will continue to advocate with the FAA and Congress while also exploring our legal options including our existing petition with the US Court of Appeals.

      1. I looked through most of this but couldn’t find an answer. Is a club responsible to verify all members have registered? In other words, is there any potential fines or sanctioning problems to a club if a club member is caught flying by FAA at field without registering. We have a large club and this is going to be a nightmare if leadership has to keep track of all members. Hopefully the answer is only the flyer is subject to fines etc?
        Thx

        1. We are not suggesting clubs police or monitor registration. That decision is up to each individual club and the club officers.

          Your club benefits (as well as member benefits) are not contingent on FAA registration. With that being said, flying sites are becoming harder and harder to obtain. There could be political ramifications if community leaders or a nearby airport learns that your members are violating FAA policy.

          1. They are becoming more difficult to find because of the ridiculous 5 Mile rule. It was 3 miles before. It should be that for Ama clubs and members again.

          2. Chad Budreau
            so you are saying that a person is ok to fly at a ama sanctioned field and not register with the faa correct.?
            if not how are the club fields supposed to determine if the
            person is legal.?

      2. It is obvious that the main cause for FAA concern is the proliferation of multi rotor “drones.” Has there been any discussion with FAA to exempt fixed wing models from registration since there is an established history of safely operating fixed wing models?

  5. Curious, did the FAA representatives join the AMA leadership at the flying site as you mentioned in the last paragraph and if so, what was their comments and reactions? THANK YOU, Ralph White

    1. I am also eager to know what transpired after this invite. Did the FAA go? If so, what was their reaction? If not, what did they give as a reason?

      I believe a lot of members would like to know the answer to the above questions.

      -Jeff

    2. No response to you question Ralph lends a NO answer to your question.
      If none of the FAA representatives attended the AMA leadership at the flying site this
      states loud and clear that the FAA does what it wants and is breaking the law that AMA has helped passed.

      “Chris Brooks January 19, 2016 at 10:15

      I hope to see the AMA pursue the flagrant violation of law in exemption article 336. This is one of many areas the government is ignoring law. While the fee is inconsequential, the proven inability of the federal government to secure private information is cause of great concern. Further the most important aspect is the need to challenge this regulation that flies directly in the face of our legislators, government and constitution. Though this impacts only “toys”, the implications are larger than just our hobby. We must hold our regulatory agencies to accountability if any law is to be respected at all.”

      Chris is on point with his comment I could not agree more!
      Also at the time of my post I see no comment from Chad Budreau to your comment Chris.

      It is sad that all the work done to pass Section 336 seems to have been in vain.

      1. Cris, like most entities we only have a limited number of resources. We are trying to answer as many questions as possible. We are shifting resources to address registration. Thank you for your patience.

        Your answer is in this blog post – we are working with Congress. In a couple days many AVPs and our EC will be headed to Capitol Hill to host a press junket and spend two days taking to dozens of key legislators.

        1. “the proven inability of the federal government to secure private information is cause of great concern”

          I just know that everyone here that agrees with this statement never gives his credit card to Omar the jackal down at the local convenience store when he pays for gas.

          He scans your card to a machine in the back room and sell the list to 1000 people in Nigeria.

    3. The meeting was very effective. We were able to demonstrate first hand our safety code in action. We even buddy-boxed with Marke “Hoot” Gibson. We flew a variety of aircraft from a 1/2 scale cub to sailplanes.

    4. No answer means they did not go. Do not renew with the Ama. The registration of the faa trumps the Ama registration. The faa offers everything the Ama offers and is 70 dollars cheaper. Insurance? Ama insurance is non existent, try collecting with all their rules to collect. Faa is the way to go if you must register.

  6. What is noteworthy to me in the above is that it appears the FAA is regulating first and establishing facts and collecting data later. Why are they just now visiting an active flying field? Do they read and or take seriously the comments they get on “regulation.gov” or is that just statutory window dressing so they can put lipstick on their administrative pigs so to speak? Imagine if the NTSB were to rely solely on data only gotten from the “video at 11″ TV news crowd. To me the potential for the” administration in the blind” of ANY issue related to safety is very disturbing and a possible indication of a dangerous bureaucratic mind set. Complexity developed in the defense of confusion leads ultimately to nonsense. The goal in all this should be safety, not nonsense.

    AMA914638(formerly 16479). I am the AMA.

  7. It’s been my experience that the FAA does exactly as it pleases. It especially ignores the laws passed by congress.
    The leadership is accountable to no one and acts accordingly.
    This will get worse before it gets better

  8. I hope to see the AMA pursue the flagrant violation of law in exemption article 336. This is one of many areas the government is ignoring law. While the fee is inconsequential, the proven inability of the federal government to secure private information is cause of great concern. Further the most important aspect is the need to challenge this regulation that flies directly in the face of our legislators, government and constitution. Though this impacts only “toys”, the implications are larger than just our hobby. We must hold our regulatory agencies to accountability if any law is to be respected at all.

    1. Actually, you need to read the law you quote. The law says the FAA will not enact regulations specifically targeting model aircraft operated for non-commerical purposes. The FAA slipped through the language by simply extending the existing full scale registration requirements to models. So, no new regulations, just the same old one that full scale has had since forever.

      Lawyers… they can always find a loophole.

      1. Oh, and the only real solution to this is to tighten the language in 336 to say “no new regulation” and “no expanding scope of existing regulation”.

        That would require intervention by the lawmakers to clarify that was the spirit of the law they passed. So, the best recourse is to contact you representatives. Whining and moaning about the AMA is not going to solve this. Quitting the only organization that groups us and mount a lobby effort is self-defeating.

      2. They don’t get to claim this isn’t a new regulation. 1) they are registering pilots, not aircraft. 2) the pilots and aircraft have existed for decades and we’re not subject to this regulation. Like in other areas of the law, discretion is not all encompassing. If a company with a patent ignores violations for years and years, they don’t get to sue someone later. The act of not acting sets precedent and limits the discretion in seeking sanction later. The FAA is being too cute by half here and they should rightly be slapped down. They are implementing new regulation against the very group they were told in law not to.

  9. I think its more of the same BIG GOVERMENT bull. Maybe a little more money grab,to feed the spenders in Washington.WHATS NEXT. Some stupid fool goes out and buys an aircraft and tries to fly it next to an airport [doesn’t know the rules,and will not join a club or the AMA or just does not care]and we all PAY.

  10. I just checked the FAA site 1/18/2015 @ 9:40 AM eastern time. If you look up Model Aircraft Operations it states if you fly within the scope of the Section 336 of Public Law 112-95 ( The FAA Modernization and Reform Act of 2012 you do not require permission to operate your UAS. What does this mean? If we don’t permission then why do we need to register?

  11. I would like to thank the AMA for all its efforts in addressing the members concerns with the FAA.

    While the meeting of Jan 15 and 16 seems to show some progress, I do have some questions. The 400 foot rule is of special interest to RC operations in our area. I hope you can share some details on how this will be resolved.

    FAA AC 91-57 dated 1981 states no model aircraft flights higher than 400 feet are permitted and operations within 3 miles of an airport should notify the airport operator. Later versions of AC 91-57A have some changes, the 400 foot limit is still stated and the 3 miles has been increased to 5 miles. Permanent operations within 5 miles of an airport should establish a mutually agreed upon procedures.

    The AMA safety code provides a different set of requirements. No flying higher than approximately 400 feet above the ground level within three miles of an airport without notifying the airport operator. This suggests we can fly higher than 400 feet if we are not within 3 miles of an airport. There is no statement that we have to develop any procedures if within 3 miles, just notification.

    So, what is going to change? Is the FAA going to change AC 91-57A to outline how we can fly above 400 feet? Is the AMA going to change the safety code to offer more explanation of the rules above 400 feet and provide clarification of the FAA stating mutually agreed upon procedures and the AMA stating notification. Is the 3 mile from an airport rule going to remain the same or is it now 5 miles?

    I think it is very important for the AMA to make sure whatever is written in our Safety Code is recognized by the FAA and the limits are clearly stated and agreed to by both the AMA and the FAA. The idea is to first keep us all safe and the second is to keep us all legal.

  12. I do not see anything good coming of all this. I say this for several reasons.

    If any moron can go to best buy and purchase a dji phantom then there is going to have to be “Strict” regulation.

    Model airplanes need space to fly and land, but need just a little skill or practice, so a little time on a sim can get you in the air, providing you have the space to takeoff. Non mini/mico Heli’s take very little space to take off and land, but great skill. I have flown for 9 years and can barely handle a 250 coaxial. I handed my 8 year old niece the controls to my 2.4kg f550 and she flew it like a pro. Experience and the investment of time, energy and money, teaches a true hobbyist to respect the craft and the surroundings, but that is not so with the moron from best buy. the fully stabilized phantom needs no room, no skill and therefore the pilot will not have the tempering of Experience, the investment of time, energy to make them a safe and conscientious flyer.

    So here is what I see happening. FAA regulated AMA flying fields. If you are caught operating your “drone”, which now encompasses ANY rc aircraft over 250g’s, outside of that venue, in open air, you will be prosecuted. not the wost case scenario, but close to it.

    OR

    FAA mandated AMA membership for anyone piloting an aircraft over 250g’s and a mandatory RC pilot safety test to be administered by the local AMA flying field. It is done for hammy’s. then you can fly anywhere that is a “No Fly Zone”. But there is the rub, look what they did in D.C. I live 4.1 miles from a regional airport, which means by law that I cannot fly even under the tree line, much less at 2-3 errors high, The FAA can literally pain us into a corner with no fly zones.

    How about all those you tube videos of ppl test hovering and flight time testing in their yards on a street lined with houses, All criminals. You cannot fly in a populated area. lots of videos of people flying their 250g+ foamies around their neighborhoods. All criminals.

    This will not end well.

    1. How are they going to enforce this? Police will not, there is no law. Is there going to be a gestapo? I fly my foamie, someone reports me, how is the gestapo going to get to the site within 10 minutes, the time it takes to go thru 2 batteries, by drone? They cannot enforce this.

  13. AMA,

    Thanks you for your efforts.

    Will the FAA UAS site be changed to clearly state the 400 foot requirement is a “guideline” before the Feb 19 2016 deadline? If not when?

    Will the FAA UAS site be changed to accept gift cards for apyment before the Feb 19 2016 deadline? If not when?

    Will the FAA UAS site clearly state the AMA Safety Code altitude guidelines within the 3 miles radius as well as clearly define the measure as nautical or statue miles?

    Until the FAA changes their UAS Site I will not register.

    1. Yes we have requested this information to be in writing and the FAA agreed to provide either FAA documentation and/or updates to their website.

    2. Ray,
      The actual registration page (not the main page of the website) has always stated that these are “Safety Guidelines for Flying Your Unmanned Aircraft”. It also states that on the printed “Certificate” that you are supposed to be able to produce on request, on the right side just above the seven guidelines.

    3. Lack of response from the Ama is proof they are in bed with the faa. Best way to send a message is do not renew with the Ama! They said for us to register with the faa, they invalidated their own existence….

  14. Payment with Pay Pal is the best way to pay, credit card number not given….
    This process smacks of government over reach
    Passing laws to fine violators would be better and cheaper.
    Use AMA as a guide to make your flight restriction laws.

  15. Let’s hope we can all work together on this issue…..I would really like an answer why the FCC stepped over Congress on Section 336. At the WRAM Show last year, FCC reps asked me prices of certain aircraft, amount of time put into aircraft and general salaries of modelers. Now, with this FCC registration, it would seem like a money grab…more money for the Federal Government.

    Is it this socialist so called transparent administration the cause of the FAA doing this to us? Will the FAA help find us new flying sites on Federal Lands…will they help the AMA on growing the model industry like they do full scale?

    Where is this money going? How will it help us modelers?

    Paul Maharis. L-386

  16. While it sounds as though the FAA representatives were receptive to AMA suggestions, were they high level enough to make decisions or just giving lip service?

    Previous AMA information seemed to say, yes, you can fly over 400 feet and no, 55lbs and over don’t have to have an N number but in this publication you leave room for doubt. Which is it?

  17. The AMA has sold AMA members down the river to the US Government and the FAA.

    I have quit the AMA and strongly recommend everyone in the AMA reconsider staying members with this current betrayal.

    The FAA and the Federal Government are out to shut down our hobby and the AMA is doing very little to stop.

    The AMA raised the Dues and then turns around and sticks a huge knife in our back.

    GOODBYE AMA!

    PS. I HAVE REGISTERED MY Aircraft.

    1. I refuse to renew my Ama membership. bu have to say thanks to the Ama for saving me 1500 dollars by me not getting the lifetime membership! Now the Ama is no longer needed I have more money for more planes, registered by the faa.

  18. Your initial news article says in part: ” All Radio Control modelers must register aircraft weighing greater than 0.55 pounds online no later than February 19, 2016.” Does that mean I have to register separately for each aircraft I own that are greater than 0.55 pounds, or is a one time registration sufficient? A reply would be appreciated.

  19. Obviously enough people at the top of the AMA have been bought off to look the other way, and are completely ignorant of the Constitution,the purpose of the AMA will eventually fade.

  20. why is the Ama not supporting and defending the 8th amendment of the constitution? Why is the Ama not supporting or defending existing law about model airplanes that congress approved? Why is the Ama telling its members about the documented privacy issues surrounding the Faa’s faulty registration website? why is the Ama not supporting or defending Ama individuals who are currently in a lawsuit with the faa? Why as a member of the Ama would I want to renew with an organization that all they do is invite the faa to come watch you fly? I’d rather renew with an organization that hires attorneys and takes legal action, then I would know my dues went to good use.

  21. So the FAA makes us agree to a 400′ ceiling, but says don’t worry about it because it does not apply to AMA members. But AMA members still have to agree to it. So are we to just trust that the FAA won’t argue we are bound by it since we agreed to it?

    Dear AMA, you need to stop worrying so much about making it members can skip the registration process. That is not a huge concern for me, but I can see where it would be a huge benefit for the AMA. Please address more important issues such as getting the FAA to word the agreement screen in a way that they are saying they “actually” mean it. How is it that the AMA is not addressing this? Who in their right mind agrees to something in writing that they know is inaccurate? For that matter, when did getting a license require a user agreement? What if when getting my driver’s license I had to agree to a cherry picked selection of ten traffic laws (out of hundreds) summarized in a ambiguous way? For example “I agree I will not drive over 70 MPH”.

    I think that is a more important battle.

  22. I will never willingly register. It is no secret that registration is simply a precursor to confiscation. Otherwise, registration serves no purpose. I have been flying RC since the 70’s, the only thing that the Federal Government has ever done for modelling is screw it up. Congress specifically forbade the FAA from registering model aircraft. The FAA is ignoring their mandate and doing as they please in committing illegal acts. If I register, than I am complicit in their act of tyranny. Tell the Feds to kiss off.

  23. Why in the world does AMA continue to publish announcements that state something like: “Pilots must register their aircraft.” We are registering pilots, not aircraft. This continuing misstatement by the AMA is causing a lot of confusion for the newbies.

    Actually, it makes the AMA’s writers look like they do not understand what is actually going on.

    What am I missing here?

  24. This is disaster to our hobby. I for one will not comply, I will not participate at local fun flies, and I will not participate at IRCHA as I have for years. I’m retired military so I know first hand how dumb the government can get but this stupid, dumb, and WILL hurt our hobby. I will continue to fly my models on private land with my buddies!
    I promise you,, IRCHA and other international events will have lower numbers this year!
    What a shame!

  25. I don’t think the AMA should encourage its members to comply with a clearly illegal regulation from a government organization that has, by law, absolutely no authority over model aviation conducted by AMA members. I want to encourage the AMA to not let the FAA hide illegal user fees in the AMA membership costs. It’s bad enough we need to spend money to fight these FAA criminals in congress and the courts, we don’t want to pay their protection money also.

  26. Reluctantly, I have registered. But it doesn’t look like the AMA has helped much. First, the web site invites us to register our Drone….I don’t have a drone, a more than two rotor flying device (or didn’t we work on a definition)? I signed a binding document that I will not fly over 400 feel, so I guess we will need to modify ALES as all registered aircraft will be illegal. If this is now the “Law” I will assume that the AMA guidelines (rules) are now obsolete as we have a defined document to the “Law”.

    Worse, even as a group 175,000+ strong has no effect on the government…only the NRA and to a lesser extent, organized labor seem to get any attention by government. Even our elected officials have lost focus on those who elected them.

    In time, I am sure the rules will take on clarity, perhaps the FAA will realize that model airplanes aren’t the problem, the toy drones are and maybe congress will actually do something……in the meantime, enjoy your next flight….while you still can.

  27. So… it is unclear to me if every model I own (25+), which exceeds .55 pounds, must be registered separately/individually. It appears that the FAA is becoming one of the most intrusive of the government entities, right up there with the IRS. Who said “the best government is the one which governs least”?

  28. Does this new FAA registration requirement apply to fixed fix RC planes or just rotor crafts?

  29. If I’m a Registered AMA member do I have to be registered with FAA to fly at a AMA flying site???

  30. Is AMA addressing The Drone Registration/Omnibus Negligence-prevention Enactment (DRONE) Act of 2016, and Assembly Bill 1662 both here in California targeting “drone” operators? How about Los Angeles City law prohibiting any night or FPV flying in city limits, even indoors? AMA never mentions these, and the FAA seems happy to abdicate it’s responsibility to maintain uniform regulation over the nation’s airspace. What’s needed is a more confrontational organization eager to take government to court, and fight for common sense. Placating a hysterical public by registering a whole community like sex offenders is wrong. Where does it stop? Knives might hurt people, skateboards? Kites might bring down a plane, so could baloons. What has this country become, and how long will we stand for it? AMA says register? I say no, and they better not register me against my will either.

  31. Not going to happen, and won’t be renewing my membership having had it for twenty plus years. You should have stopped this with a lawsuit or something. The government has their stinking hands in everything we do I have had enough, they just want us watching tv like the idiots they think we are. Sad day when you can’t fly a model without government intervention. If you had not embraced the drones I doubt you would have been held accountable, another mistake.

  32. So, the FAA did not budge at all… Well that’s it for me, as I live within the 30 mile National Capital Flight Restricted zone and am not affiliated with any local club that are now closed…
    I know the AMA leadership is working hard on these issues. However, seams like the wheels are just spinning, without traction…

  33. Absolutely not! I do not require the permission of any other person or group of persons to allow me to pursue my interests.

  34. I am now registered with the FAA. I have no qualms about the registration process. The federal government already has my personal information on file for tax and other purposes. If they want to find me they don’t have far to look. I only fly on AMA sanctioned airfields with fixed wing aircraft using AMA safety guidelines. I previously marked my airplanes with my AMA number. Now I will add a FAA identification number. I might decide to hide this under a spring loaded flap/hatch just to make it a little harder to see but it will be there. I understand there are others that believe this will restrict their desire to fly FPV in or out of the line of sight. For me this is not an issue as I fly only within the line of sight and I don’t fly FPV. To each his own. Safe flying my friends.

  35. 1)Is the AMA going to provide legal representation free of charge like the AOPA does to its member pilots?

  36. Hi
    I’ve been a modeler for over 50yrs! I have accumulated more then twenty high end scale aircraft. Are you telling me that I would have to register all my aircraft separately? When I could only fly one at a time. What am I paying AMA for? And supplying all my vitals! And still require the FAA to suck more out of me….
    Dave Page
    AMA #393201

    1. The FAA is now not only in the registering aircraft business, they are now also in registering PERSONS whether they fly an aircraft not. There must be alot of Peter Pans flying around that we are not aware of. Please protect us from these Peter Pans FAA, they could be terrorists you know………

  37. Under emotional duress I went to the FAA site to register for my privilege to fly radio controlled aircraft. Filled out the required fields. The site said that the account would not be good until I click something on an automated email that had been sent.
    No email appeared and when I attempted to re-register, it sent me a nastygram that stated that an account with that name and password already existed.
    Question:
    Will an email be sent?
    Am I in compliance with the BS law that requires registration?
    KK

    1. No, you are not in compliance. You were never assigned an FAA registration number (you didn’t pay) and you don’t have an issued certificate that you are required to have with you when flying.

    2. Same here. I have tried to register several times since the site went hot and haven’t received the “confirmation email” yet. I sent their support an email today and if no response from that, I am going to assume that I am exempt…

  38. I am the Sec/Treas of the Siskiyou County RC’ers in receipt of your announcement about having to register planes.

    However, the FAA site shows only quad copter drones. So, are our fixed wing planes exempt? If not, why aren’t they mentioned? Also, what about helicopters, not multi-rotor devices?

    Thank you, John Brooks

  39. If I understand this correctly based on your recent FAQs, control line and free flight are exempt from registration. That said, is AMA now taking the posture that we c/l types should register?

    Would like a clear answer to this, if you please.

      1. That does not appear to be stated anywhere in the federal website, and certainly not in the special rule language. In fact, the mention of the requirement to license “tethered drones” would appear to give the local law enforcement or other interested individuals the impression that CL is a “tethered drone”.

        What is required is a statement *from the FAA*, and *written down* in official FAA documents/registration FAQs, that FF and CL are not included. It was stated recently that clarification of this will not be pursued because they didn’t want to muddy the waters, or something to that effect. That leaves the FF and CL in a bad position, and given that FF and CL are about as far from the targets of the FAA (drone/RC ARF pilots) as they can be, this statement is hard to accept.

  40. This is a good step forward, but I will not register because I do not want my personal info out there for any criminal to find. I will continue to abide the AMA rules

  41. “Your comment is awaiting moderation.”

    Forgive me, but what does that mean?

    1. Like most blogging platforms, we are trying to filter spam. We do not edit comments. We do read every comment posted on here. The alternative is to require every poster to create a user account with an email and password, but we do not want to restrict or hinder comments by creating a login process.

  42. So, are we registering aircrafts or pilots? All of the language here indicates aircraft. If it is aircraft, is $5 per?

    1. The FAA is NOT registering your aircraft or Pilots. What they are registering are PERSONS who claim, or have claimed to own aircraft that they once flown, and might want to fly again. Legally, they have absolutely no AUTHORITY to be registering PERSONS. This is not a concentration camp or immigration office and if it was, how is registering proving your identity? One can pose with someone’s credit card and register in that person’s name and go and commit a terrorist act and the next thing you know, your going to be ruined for life and looked upon as a domestic terrorist. All because the FAA wants to “Interpret” the LAW for their own benefit. I wonder if it would be alright if I interpret their requirement of registering as unLAWFUL and refuse to be coerced into believing that I must register or be faced with thousands of dollars in fines and jail. They can Interpret their “guidelines”, ” rules” and “regulations” as they see fit. It doesn’t change what is written in the LAW that Congress passed under SPECIAL RULES FOR MODEL AIRCRAFT under Section 336. This is the LAW. With that being said, the FAA simply REQUIRING someone to register or face severe fines of thousands of dollars and face imprisonment is a direct violation of ones CIVIL and Constitutional RIGHTS. What the FAA is doing is called EXTORSION and Criminal coercian by unlawfully intimidating one to forfeit their RIGHTS that were given to them under LAW. I’m no lawyer, but I got a few in mind I will utilize if they come after me for exercising my RIGHTS under the LAW. The worst thing a person can do is register. Why, because you are VOLUNTARILY relinquishing your RIGHTS that were given on your behalf EXEMPTING you from ANY RULES OR REGULATIONS PROMULGATED BY THE FAA (which includes registering) and agreeing to abide by the FAA’s contractual agreement which would then supersede anything else. Those who register are in for a rude awakening. I implore anyone thinking about registering to please, read, read and reread what it says under Section 336. It’s very clear if you are NOT operating your aircraft for COMMERCIAL PURPOSES, you are EXEMPT from whatever the FAA says, and that my friend, is the LAW. Whether the FAA doesn’t interpret it that way or not, it doesn’t matter. They can Interpret it any way they want to. It doesn’t change the fact that it’s in the LAW books. FAA doesn’t make the LAW, Congress does! And Congress made a Special Rule, Special meaning something that is excluded from something otherwise regulated. Just fly like you always have and do it safely as outlined by AMA’s Safety Codes and everything is fine. They come after you, EVERYONE should help with your LEGAL defense and Counter Sue and DEMAND criminal charges be brought n each individual responsible for violating your RIGHTS!!!

  43. I am glad to see that the FAA guidelines are only that, especially with the 400 foot altitude guideline I have registered and I was somewhat concerned with that portion of the guidelines, I will continue to stand by to see what the AMA will work out with the FAA in the future

  44. Sounds like the AMA did what it thought it could and our hobby is now a government regulated industry. The FAA could ruin a junk yard, and they will ruin this hobby.

  45. I have a question regarding the the weight requirement for registration. Is the minimum weight requirement 0.55 pounds, or 55 pounds. Thank you for your time.

  46. Regarding the recommendation of placing a club owned model aircraft in the name of a club leader, I am not attorney but I consider that recommendation to be highly questionable. I am a club officer and I would not agree to place my name on an aircraft that is not directly controlled by me. In my personal opinion based on many years working as a business man and occasionally dealing with lawyers, a signed letter from the club saying that the club leader “should not be held responsible ….” probably is not worth the paper it is written on. A good old fashioned junk yard dog attorney probably would rip such a document apart in a court room. There is much that AMA is dealing with regarding the FAA registration issue. Once this issue becomes more clear I ask that AMA legal counsel revisit the issue of club owned aircraft and issue stronger guidance.

  47. still wondering if this will be worth the hassel….. finger’s crossed

  48. In your e-mail to members today (1-19-2016) you started out with the following statement:

    “AMA members are now required by regulation to register their aircraft with the FAA to avoid federal enforcement and potential penalties.”

    Just to be clear, “required by regulation” refers to FAA regulation and not a new AMA regulation, correct?

      1. I am sorry, that is *not* correct. RC modelers are required to register, but the AMA states that FF and CL models are not. This is why we need an actual STATEMENT from the FAA to that effect – the AMA seems to be all over the place with potentially misleading and contradictory statements. I am an AMA member and do not plane to ever fly RC, so according to other AMA statements, I *do not* have to register. So which is it?

        I think this illustrates the point I made above.

        1. Thank you Brett. Since you do exclusively fly FF and CL, you do not have to register. FF and CL are not considered as UAS by the FAA.

  49. This registration requirement does not fly with me, It has to be come LAW by Congress be for I would give the FAA a dime, Another federal hand out,

  50. The AMA patting us on the back while shoving a knife in it saying “Don’t worry we’ll take care of you.”

  51. It sounds as if the AMA went into this meeting with a defeated attitude. Just trying to “ease” the pain a little instead of arguing that registration is un-necessary. Lets just make it easy on our members to register since we can’t or won’t try to stop this registration nonsense.

  52. The AMA has been negotiating with, providing input to, and submitting comments to the FAA. To date, the AMA has been totally ignored by the FAA – judged by the FAA’s regulation rules.

    The FAA has studiously ignored the provisions of section 336 of the 2012 FAA Modernization and Reform Act.

    Unless the AMA bands together with model industry and vendors and takes legal action, our hobby will be destroyed.

    My Senators and Congressman, all three of whom voted for the act, won’t even reply to my letters on the subject. They don’t care and won’t help us.

  53. I am disappointed with the AMA. You have legal council, please use your legal council for something other than meetings. This is in clear violation of Federal Law. Why are there not more legal actions?

    If I have to register with the federal government and the government will be overseeing the RC hobby what do I need the AMA for? 2016 may be my last year as an AMA member.

    The OPM government data breach reported in early July 2015 impacted 21.5 million people, releasing SS numbers and all personal information for those people into the wild. So, until the Federal Government can prove my data will be safe they will not be trusted with my credit card numbers.

    Thank you,
    Brad Kelley

  54. The Academy of Model Aeronautics DOES NOT have my permission to reveal or submit my name or any of my personal information, including my AMA registration number, to any organization or government department. I joined the AMA as a private club member and do not wish anything about me be shared with anybody.

  55. The FAA is NOT mandating registration of individual aircraft for modelers/those who fly for hobby.

    Just as the AMA has put out to put your AMA number on your aircraft, you now just put your FAA sUAS number.

  56. Repeating prior correspondence with AMA, Does the FAA over-rule congress? How about they start trying to register owners of laser pens, which have been an issue. There were no problems until FPV/drones became a problem. Address the issue and STAND YOUR GROUND! I may be an AMA member, but they can’t tell if and when I fly. If you need a major fundraiser to fight this I’d rather spend $50 for legal fee’s to put the FAA to sleep. I support the AMA only to a certain point. Good luck in your efforts.

  57. This is utter BS. We should simply refuse to comply. It’s none of the government’s damned business if I fly RC aircraft. Their damned tentacles are spreading into every corner of our lives. Now we can’t even head out to the flying field without government interference. Screw em.

  58. This article states that, “Finally, there is confusion around whether members register themselves or their aircraft. Members register themselves and place their number in or on their aircraft.”

    But the latest AMA email starts out with, “AMA members are now required by regulation to register their aircraft with the FAA to avoid federal enforcement and potential penalties. All Radio Control modelers must register aircraft weighing greater than 0.55 pounds online no later than February 19, 2016”.

    No wonder there is confusion.

  59. I’m wondering why the AMA had members wait until after the free period to register. How was this outcome not forecast? I registered the first day and found it less intrusive than buying something on Amazon or signing up at ESPN. Now it will cost guys 5 bucks (not much, I concede) but there was no real need to keep them from registering in my estimation. Our hobby was not large enough to sway the FAA for several years; why did the AMA imagine that it could do something AFTER the FAA stuck their flag in the ground?

    1. Hi Michael,

      We believed we were close to finding a resolution to registration before the February deadline, which is why we suggested members hold registration. When that was not looking likely, we made the announcement at the AMA Expo and in an email the same day giving members almost two weeks to register under the free/rebated window.

      1. I do not believe that it happened this way! I’d like you to show me the email message you sent ALL AMA MEMBERS stating that we SHOULD immediately register before the FREE deadline!

        1. In collaboration with our other communication efforts (social media, blogs, website, etc…) our first mass email was sent on January 11, 2016 at 12:57 pm EST.

  60. As an AMA member and avid flier I feel as if we were sold out, and not enough was done to protect us from what is right. Why do we now even need the AMA? The goverment has it all under control. Don’t they?

  61. To Whom,
    You really don’t want me to say what is really on my mind. We are supposed to be able to have fun and learn things with this hobby, and all there is a bunch of hoops to go through and a bunch of red tape, and now that I have found out through a friend that NOW we have to register with FAA, that is BULL SH–. I have not decided whether or not to renew my membership with AMA, I have been a member since 1990, to me that is along time. There are other member’s that I have talked to feel the same way as I do This could be my very last year in getting my membership with AMA. I am very dissatisfied with the AMA is handling things.
    Respectfully
    John Burnside
    #450120

  62. I am not going to register ever. I will put my name and AMA number on my A/C and thats it.
    The FAA does not have manpower to enforce this stupid rule.
    I can go buy a gun and shoot people without a license but I need a license for my poor little model airplane. What nuts

    1. I think that it is already against the law to “go buy a gun and shoot people”, and I do not think that there is a license for that. The FAA is not asking for a license, they are asking you to register as an operator. Yes, I am sure this is against the intent of Congress, and is a stupid and illegal act on the part of the FAA, however I am not going to sweat this, and do not have the time or money to argue the facts with some junior law enforcement officer. I have registered, and I will fly safe and not worry much about the FAA.

  63. As a member of ama I feel like the organization has let its members down on this faa registration issue. We are required as ama members to place our ama number and name in all aircraft. If anything happens to one of these properly marked aircraft that would involve the faa it would be easy for them to find the owner. before you know it the faa is going to require all model aircraft to be registired at the point of purchase and this will destroy the hobby.

  64. AMA sUAS Flight Safety Guide, page 1, Basic sUAS Safety Principles:
    * Do not interfere —-
    * Yield the right of way —- etc.
    * Do not endanger —- etc.
    * Fly no higher than necessary (less than 400 feet). Remain —- etc.

    This language paraphrases to “Fly no higher than necessary i.e. less than 400 feet “.
    This statement is unconditional and not dependent on anything else. This is the AMA guideline we are trying to ask FAA to let us follow. If I adhere to this rule I cannot fly thermal duration, have to quit the hobby and don’t need to be a member in AMA, a club or register anything.

    However, I just renewed my AMA membership through end of 2018 and need AMA to clarify this point within AMA publications and before FAA.

    1. I hadn’t seen this document before. Since all model aircraft are considered sUAS by the FAA this document seems to limit all flying to under 400′. I realize they probably tried to make a document that encompasses several of the specialized documents to have all the information in one place but I don’t think this was well thought out by the AMA and the wording should probably be revised as this could definitely be used to enforce a 400′ limit. Unless this is only meant for aircraft that are not covered under 336 and therefore not ‘model aircraft’ but this would need to be spelled out in the document.

  65. Still don’t understand why one even has to register if one only flies for recreational and hobby purposes which means they are EXEMPT from ANY guidelines, rules or regulations promulgated by the FAA, including the requirement to register! What part of Section 336 does the FAA not understand? That is the LAW!!!

  66. Keep writing really long crap the means nothing that we do not already know. If the AMA does not step up they will become another IMAA that closes shop. We can get another CBO to do the job.

  67. When I went to register with the FAA, the first page says “Register My Drone”. I do not have or want a drone. So why am I registering with the FAA saying that I am registering a Drone?

    1. From: MERRIAM-WEBSTER DICTIONARY

      drone

      3: an unmanned aircraft or ship guided by remote control or onboard computers

      Drones Are Everywhere Now
      But How Did They Get Their Name?

      When did unmanned aircraft become known as drones? It was probably earlier than you think.

      Unmanned aerial vehicles were used during World War II as targets for fighters and antiaircraft guns, which had to have something to practice with. These radio-controlled aircraft were called RPVs, or “remotely piloted vehicles,” but their military creators and users soon gave up the acronym for something a little more prosaic.

  68. Well, looks like the Government, AGAIN, not listening to the people! The vast majority of the people favor the AMA ideas over the federal government. Why even have the comment portion of new rules and regulations, if your going to do what you wanted to do in the first place? Your wasting hundreds of hours of effort for nothing. Come on, admit it, you do what YOU wanted to do all along. Why?
    Because you can get away with it!!

  69. What’s with the Register My Drone. I thought the pilot was to be registered.

  70. I will preface my questions and comments with a “thank you” for the time and effort the AMA has already expended.

    However, as the UAS regustration deadline approaches, I fail to see any benefits the FAA “guidelines” have extended to active AMA members. In part, you have stated that the objective is “to find a solution for our members on the registration rule.” However, the registration deadline approaches, there are no changes on the FAA terms, and the FAA registration form does not even ask if the applicant is an AMA member or not.

    You also state that the “FAA has agreed in principle to several proposed initiatives”. It might be good policy to identify to the members what those specific initiatives are. What does “agreeing in principle” really mean? To simply recognize the AMA concerns and requests and respond with ” sounds good- we’ll look into it” does no good if there is no concrete action “before” the deadline.

    What happened to the option proposed to use the AMA membership number in lieu of a new FAA number?

    As soon as the FAA collects personal information via a contracted agent, it is too late.

    Bottom Line and my 2 cents: What has the AMA and their legal counsel actually accomplished to modify or ease the FAA “guidelines” ? It seems in reality those guidelines have simply become enforced FAA “regulations” upon registration. The FAA has accomplished exactly what it intended to do from day one. Unless I and 1000’s of other dues paying AMA members are missing a memo or an email, I fail to see any substantial recognition of the AMA efforts. It has been stated in many ways that the FAA can not regulate, but that is exactly what they have done. Debating what to call the results and negotiating proposed initiatives will make for good politics – but it will not change the deadlines and intentions of the FAA.

    Constructively, David Mathew

    Recreational power glider and quad-copter pilot.

    1. Hi David, thank you for your cordial and respectful post. We have consulted with three teams of legal advisers who all independently concur our best solution is to advocate directly with Congress and the FAA. In addition we should continue our petition with the US Court of Appeals.

      The FAA recognizes the AMA and has agreed to terms such as not requiring hobbyist to register each aircraft individually or requiring everyone to comply by law with the UAS guidelines. This is not over, we will continue to address this.

      1. Hi Chad,

        I appreciate what AMA is trying to do, but I think stronger measures are needed to get the FAA’s attention.

        The best way to change a bureaucrat’s behavior is to take away their funding. My strong recommendation is for AMA, through our contacts with Congress, raise a bill to defund $50 million of FAA funding in each fiscal year until they comply with the spirit and intent of the 2012 bill’s language. Specific departments to be defunded include the legal elements trying to subvert the Law, plus senior FAA administrators who support the poor behavior.

        When you have them by the wallet, their hearts and minds soon follow.

        Good luck … we are going to need it.

      2. But what Chad has been too polite to say to those who advocate abandoning their AMA memberships is that it is the ONLY organization advocating and LOBBYING for your hobby rights.

        To do that effectively under our governmental environment (whether you like it [the government] or not) takes TIME and MONEY. Not supporting them is very akin to shooting yourself in the foot.

        All things look simple to the simple minded.

  71. I don’t quite understand . First we are told we don’t have to register until Feb. 19th 2016 and know I am being told i have to register with FAA by 21st of January.
    When going to FAA site to register it shows pictures of different types of UAV that have to be registered and all of the pictures are of Drones. I fly fixed wings. Do I have to register and if so why are there no pictures of fixed wing aircraft? Or is this an intentional screw up to have us register.

    Respectfully
    Brian Tavishati

      1. Hi Brian,

        We believed we were close to finding a resolution to registration before the February 19 deadline, which is why we suggested members hold. Since a solution is not likely before the deadline, we believe it would be a disservice to put our members in a situation in which they could face criminal or civil penalties.

        To answer your second question, yes the FAA considers any aircraft that uses a ground control communication system (like a transmitter) as a UAS – including fixed wing aircraft.

  72. I support the AMA and its efforts regarding this UAS registration, but I’m still not understanding why I need to follow a rule that violates Congressional law. All of my model aircrafts meet all five criteria laid out in PL 112-95 sec 336. With the AMA challenging the definition of “aircraft” and getting the FAA to make more changes to this rule, there’s no reason to be in a hurry to register. New or not, this registration rule cannot apply to aircrafts meeting all five criteria in sec 336. The FAA also continues to misquote 336 by stating the FAA cannot promulgate any new rule for only model aircraft whereas 336 states the FAA may not promulgate any rule for model aircraft (subtle yet distinct difference). The FAA states aircraft registration has already existed so this is not new so they can create this rule, but then the AMA just got clarification that the rule registers pilots and not aircraft. There’s so much muddy water in this rule.

  73. Notes from the advocacy meeting on January 15 and 16 indicate that AMA can forward paper registration forms. I have 2 friends that need them to register their recreational sUAV due to lack of credit card and lack of e-mail/internet.

    How can I obtain paper forms so they can register?

  74. This registration scheme is nonsense!!!!!! Why would the AMA agree to such a thing?
    What’s next…registering model cars…cameras…a prescription from a vet to buy dog food at Wal-Mart???????
    I refuse to pay the outrageous fee of $65 for membership and I will NOT register myself as an aircraft modeler/flyer!!!!!!!

    1. Hi Henry,

      It is worth noting that we do not agree with registration which is why we are working with legal counsel, Congress, and are advocating with other agencies to the FAA.

  75. ATTENTION!!!

    According to the FAA’s FAQ’s, It looks as if even if one does register, a RC Aircraft operator still wouldn’t be authorized to fly…….so here we go again, the FAA is saying one thing, but implies something totally different! There page has been recently updated as well. With that being said, it looks like what’s going to happen is just as I suspected could very well happen. They are going to get all these ILLEGAL voluntary registrations from everyone who are too damned naive and gullible to realize that their signing their RIGHTS away in exchange of false promises and fear of being charged with large fines and criminal offenses.

    Legally, this would be called extorsion! Threatening someone with fines and criminal charges for not complying with a “regulation” that one is EXEMPT from by a LAW passed by CONGRESS! This is blatantly violating the LAW that Congress has passed under the Special Rule for Model Aircraft in Section 336.

    FAA says that Congress “agrees” that ALL aircraft is sUA, if that is so, then why did Congress pass a “Special Rule” for hobby and recreational RC aircraft?

    I could see the FAA’s point if it was only for sUA being used for COMMERCIAL purposes. But it doesn’t limit it to that.

    I’m fixing to contact my Congressman and speak to some lawmakers and lawyers. This is horse shit they are playing. Someone’s fixing to get sued. Need some names of all those involved. Needs to be some lawsuits and some accountability from the FAA.

    The FAA don’t own the airspace, nobody owns the airspace. If anyone has ownership of the airspace its the taxpayers. Federal government don’t own shit. The PEOPLE OWN IT. I’m willing to bet the BIG BUSINESSES has no problems using the airspace!

    It’s a sad day in America when government has to threaten its own citizens with criminal charges and excessive fines when the problem isn’t even with the citizens. It’s sad that LAW abiding citizens pay taxes to be dictated to and being told lies its “for our own safety”. If its for our own safety, then the FAA and government should be charged with GROSS NEGLIGENCE for the the jets slammining into the towers. But since the FAA and government can’t protect us, now we have to give up our RIGHTS and the pursuit of happiness to “PROTECT” ourselves from one another. That’s right, we pay to register, then volunteer to help the government police each other. Go to HELL FAA!!! I’m not going to support you violating my rights, my Constitutionional rights to pursue LIBERTY and HAPPINESS. You can keep your damned five dollars and your free registration. I’m not selling myself out and what RIGHTS I have left for anything. We The People tell you, yes you,and the government what we want YOU to do. Understand? You understand that? Probably not.

    Operating information

    Q50. May I operate my UAS once I register?
    A. Completion of the registration process does not provide authorization to operate your UAS. Please refer to http://www.faa.gov/uas/faq for requirements pertaining to operating authorization.

  76. I may be in the minority, but as far as I am concerned AMA did absolutely nothing for it’s members on FAA regulation except send out confusing and misleading information. Usually if you get zero return on a $75.00 annual investment you would simply not continue supporting such an organizition. However, AMA has us where they want us as you can’t fly at club fields unless you are a paid up AMA member. So here’s what we got from the AMA. From the start; we believe section 336 exempts our members (by law it does, so the FAA regs are actually illegal) and will do everything in our power to have AMA members exempted. Next; we still think we can be exempt so hold off on registering with FAA. Next; oops, you may want to register after all, all the good stuff we are doing for you won’t be done before the deadline. By the way, if you think we should sue the FAA for invoking clearly illegal regulations, you are on your own. We don’t think it’s a good idea even though probably most of our members think that option should be used. Next; we are advising our members to register now to avoid the $5.00 fee, but The FAA has agreed to let us use our AMA number for ID instead of the FAA number, and AMA members won’t have to renew.Lots more good stuff coming folks, we are still working hard on it. Next; now that we sat down and made nice with the FAA brass, it’s all good. All AMA members need to register now. The new official AMA position is exactly what the original FAA regulations were. But don’t worry, we are still hard at work advocating for you in return for your $75.00 annual dues. So what happened to AMA members being exempt? What happened to using your AMA number in place of the FAA number? What happened to AMA membership counting as FAA registration? In short, my main reason for joining the AMA was to have a large organizition that would do some serious lobbyingfor my rights ( take a cue from the NRA on how this works), instead I got an organizition that either just fell asleep at the wheel or simply rolled over and played dead instead of standing up to government overreach.

    1. George Dowell
      This comment is right on. You can add resolution of the Special Flight Restricted Areas to the list of issues the AMA has been WORKING since October with no reportable result. If the AMA is working so hard for our members, I suggest that the AMA place copies of all of the letters written to the FAA, media and various politicians on behalf of its members on the web site. This type of status reporting may end some of the frustration of the members of AMA. Please show us the official documentation of what has been done.

  77. The govt website is the biggest piece of shit ever! 2 hours and You cannot create an account. It says your account is created, but you can’t sign in. Changed passwords and says all is well, you cannot sign in. It says your account is verified, you cannot sign in. You put in your email and password, it says there is another account with that email. A total govt failure (no big suprise).

  78. Under protest, I will register. Like so many other things where this is not the place to discuss, the Federal government is overstepping it’s bounds, and infringing on our civil rights. I hope in the future you are successful in getting our AMA membership and number to serve as compliance, and the FAA provided registration can be shredded. Of course… by that time they already know those of us that have registered are flying… won’t they….

  79. Just registered per government mandate. First ad I got in e-mail was for FAA phone app called “FAA B4U Fly”. It is just a matter of time, till the government tracks every flight we make.

  80. My concern is if the FAA agrees that AMA members are not subject to the registration requirements will the data that the AMA members are providing be purged from the FAA database?

  81. So, what about control line model planes? I am not interested in hearing AMA’s opinion. AMA’s opinion has no effect in a matter of law. I want to hear FAA’s specific pronouncement on whether control line airplanes are or are not included in and/or restricted by the FAA’s requirements and regulations. This should be a simple task. Has AMA bothered to ask? Are the FAA SMEs (subject matter experts) unaware of what control line model airplanes are? Are they so un-expert in the field of model airplanes (the field in which they are making pronouncements on) that they can’t make a determination?

    1. Yes, we have addressed and resolved this question. If you would like to read the FAA’s position, you can visit http://www.faa.gov or call their support number listed on the site.

      1. It says absolutely nothing about FF and CL on the FAA site, or at least not that I could see. Could you please provide a link to the exact statement to that effect?

        1. Since Scott did not want to hear AMA’s position, I was trying to direct him to the FAA. Per his request I didn’t want to inject AMA’s interpretation. Sorry it appeared I was trying to avoid the question.

          Most topics on CL and FF were raised during the Task Force meetings. In the end, the FAA determined a UAS is an aircraft that uses a communication link to navigate in the airspace. This is addressed on the FAA website including https://www.faa.gov/uas/registration/faqs/ Q16.

          1. I understand that. Unfortunately, the phrases “control line” and “free flight” do not appear. Many people, see “tethered drone” and interpret that to mean “control-line”. Additionally, the AMA is sending out emails and stating several times here recommending “all AMA members should register”. It also say things like all model airplane larger than .55 lbs have to register. Lots of FF planes are more than that. Let’s see, a Senior Playboy with a Brown Jr. weighs about 3 lbs,.

            Even 40+ year AMA members and world and national champions see that as “all”, including them – because that’s exactly what it says

            This needs to get clarified to the point that you can tell a local police officer that “control line is exempt” or “free-flight is exempt”, and show them language FROM THE FAA to that effect. What the AMA says about it will carry little weight.

            The issue is the possibility that local law enforcement, when receiving a complaint, will use every means possible to halt flying. We have already seen local police making frequent passes by the RC field and while I don’t know if anyone has yet to be run off, the possibility that you equipment will get confiscated and never returned, regardless of the outcome of any legal proceedings, or you will get arrested and lose your livelihood, is very real.

            These are the issues at play in registration. That also why the very weak and internally inconsistent response to this by the AMA is so disappointing. This threatens the entire ballgame, and there wasn’t even an attempt to *file a restraining order* to prevent it. We have Bob Brown telling people that “drones are the future” for God’s sake. The AMA needs to take this seriously, and there is *no* indication of anything more than lip service to clearing it up.

            I should hypothetically might be exempt, or not, depending on where on this site I look, and depending on some convoluted interpretation of the FAA. When we are out at a field with the police trying to shut us down, “we are waling the halls of the FAA” isn’t going to help very much.

            I know you are just the messenger, but please carry the message to the right people in the AMA – we need real clarifications, correct and internally consistent statements that are factually defensible, and action to preclude people using this to *shut us down*. Right away.

  82. How do I get my AMA number as my FAA registration number? On the FAA web site I was advised I will be given a “discreet” number, with no opportunity to provide my AMA number. I terminated without registration.

    1. We are working on that solution, but we will not have that in place by the February 19 deadline. For now, place both your AMA number and your Federal number in or on your aircraft.

    2. The FAA website is total confusion- all the examples they show are quads- not a fixed wing in the bunch. FAA says register your drone- AMA says you are not registering your drone , you are registering as a sUAS pilot- FAA says you can use a paper form -then they tell you on the phone there is no paper forms. Congress passed a law that states the FAA cannot do this , FAA overreaches its authority and our elected representatives follow in silent lockstep. This is wrong on so many levels. Is it too much to ask of our AMA reps to try to get through to the FAA people to get this corrected on their website? thank you guys for trying/continue to try to work with these mealy mouth bureaucrat administrators who obviously are afraid to say what they mean. Ambiguity is a dangerous thing with the government .

  83. So, If I am an AMA member but don’t intend to fly, do I need to register or will I face consequences from the gestapo for being an unregistered AMA member?

  84. AMA, you’re fired….I’m sure you could have made this easier by telling the “Man” to stay out of our business. People flying these drones in unsafe manners don’t have any clue about the AMA and won’t be registering with the FAA. I think our membership with the AMA should be concurrent to having a registration with FAA. Just give them ” the FAA ” our membership number and end of story..Why ad new numbers and registrations to the mix? Now people my be on two different registrations using two different variations of their name ie.. One with a middle initial, one with-out. Too many complications.. My point again. People doing illegal things don’t register anything…

    1. Clyde, it is worth noting that we did tell the FAA to (as you put it) “stay out of our business.” We spent months on Capitol Hill helping draft and pass Section 336 which protects hobbyists from FAA regulations.

      1. Chad,
        Sorry, but please explain how section 336 that AMA helped draft and pass “protects hobbyists from FAA regulations” when the official AMA position is all members should just go ahead and register for the regulations we are protected from. IMHO, if AMA had any backbone, they would advise members not to register and offer legal defense to any members fined for not registering, and fight the FAA in court. Playing nice with the FAA is quite obviously not working.
        So let’s say the AMA somehow grows a backbone and succeeds in getting AMA members exempted from regulation (by LAW we clearly are), what then happens with the data the FAA has collected on all the AMA members that followed your advice to go ahead and register while you are still “advocating” on our behalf?

        1. Hi Daniel,

          UAS Registration is a Federal requirement and while we are working on solutions, it is unlikely to resolved by February 19. We do not want our members to be subject to civil or criminal penalties.

          In addition, AMA has a tremendous safety record. We want to maintain that safety record and compliance with the airspace.

          It should be noted, that in addition to working with the FAA, we are also meeting with key legislators on Capitol Hill and still have a petition in the US Court of Appeals.

      2. Chad, with all due respect. What??? Please re-read what you just wrote. If you really do believe that Section 336 protects hobbyists from FAA regulations..I must ask –

        Why do you(the AMA representative), especially after having “spent months on Capital Hill helping draft and pass Section 336 which protects hobbyists from FAA regulations”, recommend that we register?

        Is the AMA’s recommendation to register made to protect ourselves because just maybe, Section 336 won’t protect us? Or is it simply to protect the AMA organization from making a recommendation that gives the appearance of suggesting non-compliance with a FAA Regulation?

        I think I know the answer and hence would respond ahead of time that one can’t have their cake and eat it too. It really just gives the impression of wanting it both ways and is not a good approach when claiming to represent a constituencies interest.

        1. AMA has an amazing history of safety and respect for the airspace. As it stands now, UAS Registration is a Federal requirement. Therefore we are suggesting our members continue to comply with all applicable rules and regulations. We also do not want our members to be subject to civil or criminal penalties.

          This does not mean the issue is over, for example we are meeting with key legislators next week on Capitol Hill. For now, it is unlikely we will have this resolved by the February 19 deadline.

  85. Regarding club-owned aircraft the following was suggested: For those clubs that own a model aircraft as an organization and not as an individual, we requested clarification as to how to register the model. We concluded that those models should be registered under the registration of one of the club leaders. To protect that club leader who voluntarily placed his number in or on the club aircraft, the member should have a written document from the club indicating he or she should not be held responsible and is simply providing a registration number on behalf of the club.

    I feel this leaves the “registrant” in a tough legal position in that he/she may not be the instructor or student flying that model should an incident occur. Just like civil aviation, the owner of the aircraft can be held liable as a “participant” even though someone else was piloting the owners aircraft. The deepest pockets will always be the target of litigation. As a club member, that registrant is obviously a “participant”. A letter from the club stating the registrant “SHOULD” not be held responsible is not worth the paper it is written on. I feel this issue needs far more legal investigation and that making a club member a target is very unfair.

  86. Is the “visual line of sight ” rule also just a guideline or is that a hard rule from the FAA? If it is a hard rule then do our clubs need to enforce that and not allow FPV?

    1. All of the guidelines on the UAS registration site are just that, “guidelines.” If you abide by our safety code, continue to fly. FPV is allowed if in compliance with our 550 document.

      1. Thank you. So if there is an accident AMA has been assured by the underwriters of their insurance policy that claims involving FPV will be honored and not denied based on the INTERIM FEDERAL RULE (as the FAA puts it) regarding visual line of sight? Being the treasurer of my AMA chartered club, I have vested interest in saving my club and members from an expensive suit

        1. You are correct, Federal Registration will not affect your AMA insurance. You can continue to fly and abide by our safety code. As for FPV, refer to document 550.

          1. Chad, specifically about the INTERIM RULES that state Visual Line of Sight, not Registration. So, according to Doc 550, a spotter with VLOS must accompany anyone flying FPV and, because of that, insurance would cover an accident even though the operator was not in compliance with the federal INTERIM RULES on requiring the operator and not the spotter to have VLOS. Sorry to be picky but, working in the insurance industry myself, I am aware of the intricacies involved. Thank you for your replies and comments.

          2. Timothy, fair question. I would encourage you to call our Safety and Member benefits team at 1-800-435-9262 for more clarification. AMA members are expected to comply with all applicable laws, rules, and regulation – but FAA registration is not a prerequisite to AMA membership.

  87. The perceived problem that the FAA, public, etc is real and is caused by the proliferation of multirotor aircraft and the use of FPV which is continuing to increase out of control by manufacturers and people who do not belong to the AMA or really know or care about rules and will not likely register or ever be prosecuted, so why should fixed wing flyers who have flown for years with few problems be punished.

  88. So is the AMA giving up and saying members should register? I seem to detect a little double talk, for example the FAA calls the 400′ max altitude a guideline while at the same time you must click on a button during registration saying you agree not to fly above 400′. Which is it? When I fly my airplane (an Ares Gamma 370 foamie)I don’t know what the altitude is and have no idea how to tell with any degree of accuracy.

    Also, this registration process online is 100% automated so what do they need 250 new employees for? If someone is flying a model in an unsafe or exclusion zone it is most likely going to be someone local calling the police. Nobody is going to call the FAA. It would seem that the FAA would mainly go to places know for flying (local flying fields) to bust people not registered and posing no threat to anything. The only logical excuse for reregistration once you have a number is to raise money to pay the salaries of all the FAA agents that will be checking on you. I’ve had the same social security number for 63 years, never reregistered it, and the government has no problem know who I am or how to find me.

  89. I’ve just registered. I feel sad for some reason. Why, I ask?
    I feel like the terrorist have won. I was in the air on September 11th and I’ve seen the advent of the Department of Homeland Security and sense of security we once had, disappear with the collapse of the World Trade Centers.
    Sure there are lone wolf terrorist’s but the reality is the Radical Islamic movement have impacted our way of life and have caused us to loose freedoms we once took for granted. Almost every Muslim country is in conflict and what have they contributed as a collective in the last centuries?
    A little piece of freedom has been lost…a boy or girl who wants to build and fly something as innocent as a model airplane, the images, which soar in his/her imagination, are now stained by the fact that they have to register with our government, just to play. You have to, you must explain to the children the reality of our dangerous world.
    And I suspect…the bureaucrat’s are gleefully, or smugly, celebrating the rise of a new department, new revenues, new power, new fiefdoms at the expense of something else, something we’ve lost. And I think and ask myself what is it we’ve lost? Is it five dollars? I don’t know…I have a feeling it will morph into something larger, more burdensome…more expensive. But eventually, the RC’ers will get used to it, pay the fee’s, pay the fines, go through the hassles…
    Not too far in the distant future – like before September 11th, you could run through the airport and catch a flight at the last minute, the RC community will forget what it was like to be able to buy balsa wood, build a model in the basement with your friends, put an engine on it, take it outside an fly.
    You can’t do it anymore…you haven’t registered, you haven’t paid your fee…we need to buckle under the potential of a looming threat…fear. Someone may strap a bomb on a model plane to wreak havoc on the civilian population. The thing is, anyone who wants to do harm in this manner…they are not going to be the ones who register…there not going to be the ones who play by the rules.
    We’ve lost more than just freedom, we’ve lost our innocence. And innocence is necessary to let our imaginations soar, creativity to flourish, innovation to thrive. Its a sad day.

  90. What a crock!!!!!Thanks AMA? In the 1930 thru 1940 NAZI Germany required their people to have their “PAPERS”. In 1947 when the UK
    Gave India their “FREEDOM” The India government imposed new regulations that impeded progress of their people. In china in1970 came the cultural
    revolution wherein individuals had to sign papers showing what books and
    reading material they had.They were told to get rid of certain material.
    A year later they were investigated snd put into prison for hoarding certain items.NOW IN AMERICA We seem to be heading in the same direction. Because of BIG corporations wanting to hoard the airspace with help by the government I call fascism.
    Ok if they want exclusive use of the airspace let them fly up where
    all the other commercial craft fly.
    Lets say IFR only 1K east and 2K west bound and special small transponder with special code indicating “commercial drone” and Mode C
    Captn Don

  91. Have I been missing something? The application for registering addresses drones. I have zero (none).Do I need to register the 8 fixed wing planes I own and fly?

  92. While it is great that the FAA has addressed some of these concerns, where is to officially published by the FAA where the public can see (and print) these clarifications?

    In a previous blog post it was mentioned the FAA would update their registration site and clarify the registration agreement in regards to the ‘new’ FAA guidelines and the existing AMA (CBO) guidelines. I have not seen a change yet. Is this planned to happen before the February 19th deadline?

  93. Question / Concerns

    Why is AMA and FAA still using the language ‘Register Aircraft’ or ‘Register UAS’ in context of registration for aircrafts under 55lbs?!?! It is very important that this vernacular is removed from verbal and written correspondence. If not, there is nothing prohibiting FAA from simply making a slight change and my 20 RC models suddenly cost me $100! Do our AMA leaders get this, or should we have someone else represent AMA to FAA?

    Second, when will the 400′ ceiling we agree to during registration will be removed, or changed to something like – ‘I recognize and will adhere to the 400′ guideline when not flying my UAS in a non AMA (or other organization) sanctioned field as I follow those restrictions.’

    Come on AMA, this is not brain surgery, simple request from AMA to FAA, requests with suggestions.

    Hope this makes sense, I have not registered my self as an UAS operator until I see the changes.

    Thank you for all that you do, I am sure it is not easy but at the very least lets get our very own blogs, media alerts, and other correspondence right!

    Kevin

  94. Did you ask them why they make a rule that says they won’t be regulating models that are used for recreational purpose, and then break that rule?

  95. it seems as though the a.m.a. had no input in to the making of the f.a.a. ruling. I don’t suppose it matters much but I am extremely disappointed in the a.m.a. and the f.a.a. for their failure to not recognize the real problem which is the word “drone”. Also the fact that the people whom register are not going to be the people who screw up. PLease go after the media’s “drones” and not my Model Airplanes.

  96. I contacted the sight you had a hot blue link for and it says to register a drown. I do not have a drown or fly one. I am a sailplane and airplane pilot. Do I register there anyway?

    1. AMA blog says:

      Q: Do only drones and multirotor pilots need to register?
      A: The Interim Final Rule regarding sUAS registration requires all unmanned aircraft that are part of an unmanned aircraft system be registered. Being part of an unmanned aircraft system means aircraft that are flown using a ground-control system, such as a transmitter, in essence radio control model aircraft. This includes pilots who fly fixed-wing RC aircraft and helicopters, not just multirotors or drones. Any pilot flying models weighing between .55 pounds (or 250 grams) and 55 pounds is required to register.

  97. You have given the FAA exactly what they wanted. We have to register giving our personal information to a public data base to be able to “legally” fly, and we have to pay them for what we were already paying you to be able to do.

    Once submitted, there is no way to undo the damage.

  98. I will not agree to terms which illegally require me to voluntarily limit my aircraft to below 400 ft. This is not negotiable for me. If the FAA wants to come after me, I will probably be a test case for their authority under section 336 of the reauthorization. If, however, AMA is telling me that their community based standard is to fly below 400 ft AGL, then I will follow that guideline. AMA: figure this 400 ft policy ASAP. The current guidance herein does not provide me usable guidance.

    1. We have resolved the 400ft policy as mentioned in this blog post. Continue to fly as long as you abide by our safety guidelines!

      1. Thanks Chad, for going over and above the call of duty to answer AMA member’s concerns. Who knows what direction the FAA would have taken this registration if AMA advocacy had not been involved.

        Dave S

      2. Chad,

        This is most definitely NOT resolved. As long as FAA requires registrants to agree to “fly below 400 feet” the issue remains unchanged.

        1. The guidelines suggested by the FAA are just that, guidelines. They are not legally binding and are even identified as “guidelines” and not law. The 2012 Special Rule for Model Aircraft on the other hand is law.

      3. Chad,

        With all due respect, I would feel much better about registering AFTER FAA updates their language on the registration form that we are asked to agree with. That agreement is between me and the FAA, regardless of my affiliation to AMA.

        1. Understood. We requested clear documentation from the FAA to reassure our members. If you visit the FAA UAS regsitration site, you will now notice that they are using the term “Guidelines.” The FAA is not using terms like “requirements” or “regulations.” These are simply guidelines and are not law.

          1. I have an honest question, so therefore, please give me an honest answer.
            If these are all “guidelines” and NOT rules and regulations by the FAA, then registering is NOT a Federal Law? Is this correct?
            Please show us where this is Federal LAW that a person who flies rc model aircraft as a hobby and for recreational purposes only and follows a CBO safety GUIDELINES must register or face fines and criminal charges.
            It looks to me that what the LAW really says is that ANYONE who operates a sUAS COMMERCIALLY and for PROFIT is are the ONLY parties that must Register with the FAA. Everything else is EXEMPT!
            All this nonsense that the FAA is trying to convey that ALL sUAS must register is false and unenforceable on their part. The LAW under Section 336 says otherwise.
            Patiently awaiting your reply sir…….

          2. I believe it has always stated “Guidelines”, but I could be wrong on that. It took the FAA no time at all to get the registration site up, one would think that the verbiage could quickly and easily be changed. Here we are about to end January, and the site still has ‘Register My Drone” button on the first page!

            Why would we want to go through the process, click the button that says, I WILL fly within these ‘Guidelines’ when we already know we have not intentions to do ing so. I am flying IMAC contests for the first time this year, and I already know I will exceed 400′, I also know that I am registering myself, not my “drone”.

            If I know I am not registering my “drone”, and I know that I will exceed the 400′ ceiling, then why register at all?

            By the way, ‘Guidelines’ are the first step to passing Bills and making Laws!

          3. The registration process requires a person to agree in writing to “I will fly below 400 feet”.

            Therefore, you have NOT solved this problem. Please understand that nobody is debating what is in the law, or the difference between guidelines and law.

            What we are saying is that we are being forced to sign a contract that seems to override any other written mention of altitude.

            Please try to get the FAA to correct this, in writing, so that we can then register.

      4. Chad, while I agree and support the AMA’s position as far as its safety guidelines and in compliance with PL 112-95 Section 336 I feel it’s important that the FAA also publicly and in writing acknowledges this fact clearly. Most specifically about the 400′ rule. It is critical that if an AMA member has to produce to a LEO an FAA registration certificate that specifies this restriction he can also show an FAA document describing this exemption. Many if not all FAA information has not been updated in month and still reflect the FAA’s previous interpretations.

        With this in mind I have the following questions to AMA’s leadership that I hope you can address and answer:

        1) Does the AMA have a clear indication from the FAA,as to the above issues, being addressed by the FAA in writing before the registration deadline of February 19, 2016.

        If not I have the following question:

        2) Has the AMA asked the FAA, if one of its member does not register by the deadline, but grounds its fleet (i.e. Not fly his/her model airplanes) until a resolution to question #1) has been reached, are they in violation of the FAA’s IFR and more specifically the registration requirement?

        I have a few additional questions and comments, that pertains to a potential solution, to FAA’s mandate to integrate sUAS in the NAS that I feel would not contradict PL112-95 Section 336.

        3) Has the AMA asked, or know of any plans for, the FAA to actually depict all AMA sanctioned field on VFR Sectional charts?

        This would be an effective way to give full scale aviation a proactive way of avoiding model aircraft activities. I realize that the burden is on us to “see and avoid” but this burden is also on general aviation under FAR part 91! If a full scale pilot doesn’t know where we operate they are in the dark about our activities and that is contrary to FAA’s longtime concept of see and avoid by all aircraft (since they now consider our model airplanes aircrafts). To support the above the FAA has already set the precedent to this, if you look up on their web site the legend for sectional charts ( on or about page 47 I think) you will find symbols for glider activities, ultralight activities and more importantly UAV activities, so why not simply add Model aircraft (MA) activities to the charts?

        Now if this was not considered or not approved by the FAA:

        4) Has the AMA considered or researched the possibility to simply have all AMA sanctioned fields issue a “Permanent NOTAM” for model aircraft activities, let’s say “1 mile radius and up to 1500′ AGL”, for all fields and in compliance with current NOTAM (Notices To Airmen) rules. NOTAM’s are, by FAA rules, designed to do just that, notify all airman of any activities that my affect airmen in the NAS and I believe anyone can issue a legitimate one ( i.e. Temporary towers, fireworks, laser shows, etc…) while those examples are temporary in nature NOTAM’s can also be permanent in nature, just like the DCA TFR, that would be a good step towards increased safety and integration of sUAV’s in the NAS.

        On another note, I have seen many blogs stating that the AMA saw this new regulation as a way to increase their membership, and profit from it, as the largest national Comunity Based Organization (CBO). I feel this is an unfounded accusation, AMA has been our advocate for 80 years and must get credit where credit is due, we have an excellent safety record due to a comprehensive set of safety guidelines that I feel have served us well and have adapted to new technologies rapidly. This was/is possible because the AMA is not burden by governmental red tape and politics. If the AMA is now positioned to become the private extension of the FAA under the current rules and in accordance with PL112-95 Section 336 it is because their dedication to Model aviation and not the lack thereof.

        The precedent for this has already been set by the FAA under the FAR Part 103 rules for ultralights. The FAA created this part to define what an ultralight is but does not license pilots or certify ultralights, this is done essentially by CBO’s like the EAA (Experimental Aircraft Association) or the USUA (US Ultralight Association). Again, I feel the FAA set the precedent of where model aviation under PL112-95 section 336 should be today.

        Maybe Model aviation, under 336, could be incorporated in part 103 or have its own part under the FAR’s and remain self regulated as intended by 336. If the AMA is in the best position to do so today, it is not a conspiracy to profit from this but rather a result of their commitment to our hobby of model aviation. The AMA is not exclusive, anyone out there is free to start their own CBO and operate under PL112-95 Section 336.

        Chad, I know this got to be a little longer than I planned but I felt those were valid points worth mentioning.

        I’m looking forward to hear your or AMA’s answers to question 1 through 4 above as I feel they would be relevant to our members especially 1 and 2.

        Thank you.

        1. All good questions sir. I am waiting for the AMA minion to trot out some answers that make sense.
          TJE AMA8855

          1. Me too…and I hope it all comes before 19 Feb. If it is not documented, it did not happen!

  99. I am concerned about this regulation another attempt at taking away my rights.

  100. Not going to register. I don’t believe that the FAA has that authority, and I don’t believe it will increase the safety of anyone, and I don’t feel like paying $5 and giving away valuable private information to do something I’ve been doing for over 40 years.

  101. Coped this from the FAA website on who needs to register

    13 years of age or older. (If the owner is less than 13 years of age, a person 13 years of age or older must register the small unmanned aircraft.)
    A U.S. citizen or legal permanent resident.

    So an illegal immigrant don’t have to register ??

  102. This government control nonsense started in the early 1990s, perhaps Trump is right!
    That said my question is that as an AMA member does all this hold true if I do not fly at an AMA Field? e.g. Just a few moths ago I flew in the Califoria desert on a piece of BLM land.
    Another question! Is the AMA aware that our spying government may have hacked into our AMA internet network?
    Fran

  103. I asked this question yesterday over email, have not heard back yet, actually I have not heard back about the question I had about the silly rule for Control Line.

    I was asked to agree to the following “I will not fly near aircraft”, but you also state that “The FAA considers drones to be “aircraft,””. I often fly with others in my club, I’m sorry but this does not work for me and my members. If you say just ignore this, then what else can I just ignore?